Slimdevices Squeezebox / Squeezecenter Support (Plugin) or D

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po4599
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Re: Slimdevices Squeezebox / Squeezecenter Support (Plugin) or D

Post by po4599 » Thu Jul 01, 2010 12:08 am

I would like to follow the post from UncleBoarder with a reset back to the original 'idea' post I made over a year ago. The proposed idea was to use the power of MediaMonkey's (MM's) ability to manage a music library/database with SqueezeCenter's ability to stream the music to players. Yes, MM can play music nicely when you're in front of the computer. But you can't control MM play using an iPhone or remote control. There are hundreds of other solutions that also let you play music on a PC including the popular Winamp (my favorite) or iTunes (if you like Steve).

The purpose of the suggestion was to combine the power of remote playback using remote audiophile devices such as SqueezeBox (SB) and remote control of what is playing using a LinkSys remote (Squeezebox Duet) or an iPhone/iTouch/iPad (iPeng) with the power of MM's library management.

It's worth reading the background information from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Squeezebox ... ry_2008.29 for additional information in case you want to see more about the devices.

SqueezeBox (SB) is the player, and SqueezeCenter (SC) is the streaming source that reads the music database and sends it to the player. Decompression and playback is done in SB, providing an extremely high quality latency free audio playback. The SB device is usually located in your stereo system, with some homes deploying multiple SBs in different rooms of the house (Living Room stereo system, Master Bedroom Stereo, Kitchen countertop etc.) For those that want to stream music from the music server (SC) to their PC, there is a SqueezePlayer (SP).

SqueezeCenter is the core of the SC/SB setup, and is the software that controls playback to the various players (SBs, SPs, etc.) and provides powerful capabilities for controlling many players, and to sync those players together if you want to stream music to multiple rooms simultaneously. The most powerful feature SC is that you can use a remote control (SB Duet) or your iPhone/iTouch/iPad (using iPeng) to control playback from anywhere in your house.

The problem with SC is that it has absolutely no ability to manage a library and is implemented as a free Perl program that runs under your web browser. It's slow. Very slow. And since it's free there is no motivation to upgrade the capabilities. It can scan a disk directory. Rescanning takes hours. There is an add-on that can force re-scans at night. So when you add a song to your library you can't play it until tomorrow.

MM is fabulous at library management, and slices and dices like nobody's business. The original post from a year ago suggested combining the library management with SC's stream control. The specific suggestion was to extract the streaming/remote interface portion of SC (which is open source) and inserting it into MM. This would allow MM to act as a SC-like media server to SB devices. SB Duet, iPhone/iPeng etc. could be used to select what is playing (or you could use the PC screen... but what's the point?). You could select playlists, or setup auto-streaming from hundreds of internet radio sites (used to be thousands, but you know... with the economy the way it is...).

(Ed. note for MM exec's... if you make this work, Cisco may be interested in acquiring the company to add to the Linksys SC/SB solution set... they are always looking for ways to bring market share into their products while adding value they can charge for.)

So to respond to the various posts:
1. Anybody that starts with "I can select what I play using the MM interface" is missing the point. Using MM to select what to play forces you to be in front of the PC. Can't use a remote or iPhone/iTouch, and can't stream to the living room audio system.
2. Attempting to sync two databases also misses the point. The point is to have one database with real-time update. There was a very clever Vbasic script posted by m_schuitema to tell SC to play the same song... as long as the libraries are in sync (which are just file directories). With rescan in SC taking 4 hours, you can play your song "soon". Poster 'Wbdh' showed one of the many problems with this path. It's similar to the wmb54g solution above. And it still requires #1 above.
3. Using 3 database makes it worse. Specifically using Windows Media Player (WMP) to somehow stream to SC and managing your database with MM sounds insane. Closely related is the idea of using the brain dead iTunes library management and the SC 'iTunes connection' to somehow keep things organized. For those that haven't tried this, it's worth wasting a weeking playing with it. You'll realize how brain dead it really is. There is a reason it's been abandoned.
4. Using PS3 mediaserver? Mario loves this device. Music doesn't. However note that the PS3 IS in the living room audio system, so you can use the PS3 to select what song to play using the PS3 remote. And using the WMP database of course. And not using MM because it fights with WMP. But it may work for some of you.
5. For those that talk about library, it's more than just the filename. It's the 'star ranking', and the 'number of times played', and the playlists, and the streaming media sources. MM is amazingly great at managing this stuff.
6. To reply to the post from UncleBoarder about using NAS, any networked computer can be an NAS. But they are just files, and you still need a SqueezeCenter (SC) to stream the data to your playback device (SB, SP). How long will it take you to add an mp3 song and play it through your NAS/SC/SB solution? Last time I did it, I measured about 20 minutes getting SC to scan it in vs. under 5 seconds using MM.

And to 'gpzbc' interesting 'marketing' teases about MM4 taking music from WMP. You can do this with Winamp already in a free, much lighter weight program. And then you're tied to the WMP library management. Have you used this solution? Why would you ever want to do this?

So here we stand with a media dominant play controller (iTunes) that's brain dead with very limited library management. An audiophile quality remote capable playback system (SB/SP/Duet/iPeng) that can only stream from a POS database server. An excellent music library management system (MM) that only talks to itself (though I'll give it a nod to attempting to sync to my iTouch... it trashed the filesystem and forced a full restore on the device). And of course a super fragmented bunch of pieces that can be used as mortar to make something work. Unfortunately, I haven't found a way to cobble them together.

Ideas are most welcome and appreciated. For now I'm wonderously using SC/SB/iPeng/MM/WinAmp/iTunes/PS3 together that works on any day except those ending in 'y'. Your mileage may vary.

nohitter151
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Re: Slimdevices Squeezebox / Squeezecenter Support (Plugin) or D

Post by nohitter151 » Thu Jul 01, 2010 7:38 am

po4599 wrote:But you can't control MM play using an iPhone or remote control.
Sure you can:
http://melloware.com/products/imonkey/
http://www.mediamonkey.com/support/inde ... icleid=120
MediaMonkey user since 2006
Need help? Got a suggestion? Can't find something?

Please no PMs in reply to a post. Just reply in the thread.

sg60
Posts: 86
Joined: Sun Feb 11, 2007 1:13 pm
Location: Kitchener, Canada

Re: Slimdevices Squeezebox / Squeezecenter Support (Plugin) or D

Post by sg60 » Thu Jul 01, 2010 8:02 am

I've been following the posts on this topic and I thought I'd add my two cents. I have a SB as well and I want to use it because I can use the wireless controller without having to go to the computer to access MM.

SqueezeCenter cannot adequately replace MM because it doesn't come close to MM when it comes to managing music and MM's tools for playing music (eg. Playlists) are far superior in terms of capability and especially ease of use. SqueezeCenter is open source so it's definitely configurable but it's not easy to do this. The built in tools are good but limited and the add-ons are often not that easy to use and not as robust as the tools offered by MM. Unless you know how to program you are left with the tools that are available from SqueezeCentre and developers. MM already has superb tools built in. It's the best I've ever come across for managing and playing music.

Like the previous poster I have a NAS that I use to store all of my music in FLAC format. The NAS sits in the living room beside my stereo. In order to access and manage the music on my NAS I also need a computer with MM on it so I have a laptop that sits in the living room with the NAS. I play the music on the laptop from the NAS through an external DAC to my stereo. This system works really well.

What would make it better is if I could access the MM library and playlists from the Squeezebox controller. That way I would only have to use the computer when I'm doing music management tasks. I use playlists 90% of the time when I'm listening to music. I'd like to use the Squeezebox controller to access playlists or the library to play music. The SB controller has a visual display that shows what is playing and would also allow me to look at the playlist or library if I choose. I could do all of this without ever having to access the computer. That would be the ideal solution for me.

Lowlander
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Re: Slimdevices Squeezebox / Squeezecenter Support (Plugin) or D

Post by Lowlander » Thu Jul 01, 2010 10:40 am

For Playlists from MediaMonkey to Squeezecenter check out: http://www.mediamonkey.com/forum/viewto ... =2&t=34512 it can be set to automatically export playlists and probably would do a good job in bridging the gap between MediaMonkey and Squeezecenter.
Lowlander (MediaMonkey user since 2003)

sg60
Posts: 86
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Location: Kitchener, Canada

Re: Slimdevices Squeezebox / Squeezecenter Support (Plugin) or D

Post by sg60 » Thu Jul 01, 2010 12:04 pm

Thanks, I'll look into that.

UncleBoarder
Posts: 20
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Re: Slimdevices Squeezebox / Squeezecenter Support (Plugin) or D

Post by UncleBoarder » Fri Jul 02, 2010 10:38 pm

Lowlander wrote:For Playlists from MediaMonkey to Squeezecenter check out: http://www.mediamonkey.com/forum/viewto ... =2&t=34512 it can be set to automatically export playlists and probably would do a good job in bridging the gap between MediaMonkey and Squeezecenter.
OMG... I've been looking for this!! Fantastic. Support is excellent, this guy is responsive and helpful. Why isn't this Addon listed in the MM Addons??

If you're going to use if for SlimServer, I recommend you do not use the "Extended .m3u format". Prior to unchecking that option, just browsing a playlist took minutes and actually caused my squeezebox to stop playing for a few seconds.

Thank-you Lowlander!

Lowlander
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Re: Slimdevices Squeezebox / Squeezecenter Support (Plugin) or D

Post by Lowlander » Fri Jul 02, 2010 11:26 pm

You're welcome, I use it too for my Roku Radio and Sony TV and it's a wonderful script.
Lowlander (MediaMonkey user since 2003)

m_schuitema
Posts: 4
Joined: Sun Sep 14, 2008 9:09 am

Re: Slimdevices Squeezebox / Squeezecenter Support (Plugin) or D

Post by m_schuitema » Sat Jul 03, 2010 4:12 am

bill37027 wrote:
m_schuitema wrote:Hi folks, I am also a squeezebox & MM lover and I made a script with settings to control squeezebox by using MM as the UI. So when MM starts playing a song it will send a command to the squeezecenter to start playing the same song. Works cool (at least at my place).
Wow, thank you for the code.

Question, you say "So when MM starts playing a song it will send a command to the squeezecenter to start playing the same song" Does this mean I need to maintain two databases of songs, or does MM actually stream the audio to squeezecenter, so I can maintain all my music in one place, MM?
Indeed, in my setup I have my audio on a network share which is scanned by SB and MM, so you indeed have two databases, but it is just a matter of rescanning both once a while. MM does NOT stream the music to SB in my solution.

glubbelubb
Posts: 1
Joined: Tue Sep 28, 2010 6:01 pm

Re: Slimdevices Squeezebox / Squeezecenter Support (Plugin)

Post by glubbelubb » Tue Sep 28, 2010 6:05 pm

m_schuitema wrote:Hi folks, I am also a squeezebox & MM lover and I made a script with settings to control squeezebox by using MM as the UI. So when MM starts playing a song it will send a command to the squeezecenter to start playing the same song. Works cool (at least at my place).

An example of the squeeze.ini file:

Code: Select all

enableSqueeze=True
squeezeCenterIp=192.168.0.200:9090
playerName=Squeezebox
mediaMonkeyPath1=\\HUSHY\music1
squeezeCenterPath1=/home/marcel/Music/disk1
mediaMonkeyPath2=\\HUSHY\music2
squeezeCenterPath2=/home/marcel/Music/disk2
powerOffOnExit=True
Hi, thanks for the great script, I'm just having a problem with some error messages, each time a new song is playig: "error sending command to squeezebox". Music plays without problems, by the way. Maybe you can specify which directories I have to enter in the squeeze.ini? I put my music directoy in both entrys for Path1. Is that right? I have only one library, so I deleted Path2.

Metazargo
Posts: 41
Joined: Mon Jan 25, 2010 8:24 am

Re: Slimdevices Squeezebox / Squeezecenter Support (Plugin)

Post by Metazargo » Sat Oct 30, 2010 1:04 pm

I just tested* the 'Play to Squeezebox' script. Such an integration should work as smooth with SB as the iPeng on my iPhone.

I remain with the way I do it today sitting at my home office desk. While I manage, tag and rip music, I just switch the stereo to my notebook. If the MM-SB integration would be a full featured plug-in, of course I would use it.

Currently I use the export playlist plug-in, cool!


*: I had to first register 'socket.dll', see http://www.visualbasicscript.com/Script ... 38306.aspx, cause I have a Windows Server 2003.


PS: My main problem between MM and SB is related to delimiters, do you all use '/'? See my post here http://www.mediamonkey.com/forum/viewto ... =1&t=53078
Music Management: Media Monkey 4.0.2.1462
Music Playing: Squeezebox Server (QPKG); Squeezebox Touch, -Radio, -Controller, -Receiver; SoftSqueeze; iPeng on iPhone
Music Store: QNAP TS-259 Pro with Western Digital Caviar Black 2TB WD2001FASS in Raid 1 Ext3

Guest

Re: Slimdevices Squeezebox / Squeezecenter Support (Plugin)

Post by Guest » Thu Nov 04, 2010 8:11 am

This isn't probably a proper fix, but will get rid of the error "Error Sending Command To The Squeezebox". Open the script with notepad or whatever text editor. Then find the lines
' Retrieve answer
response = socket.GetLine
response = Trim (response)
If StrComp (command, response) <> 0 Then
text = "Error sending command to SqueezeBox" & vbCrLf & vbCrLf &_
"Send: " & command & " (" & Len(command) & ")" & vbCrLf & vbCrLf &_
"Received: " & response & " (" & Len(response) & ")"
MsgBox text, vbOKOnly + vbCritical, "Squeeze Error"
End if
Then delete them. I believe the squeeze returns the command different than it receives it. I really don't know how to change it to make it correct. I used it all day yesterday after removing the above lines and it worked perfectly. Thanks to the guy that wrote the script. I sure hope he and other script guys pick this up. With a little more tweaking this could be great for Squeezebox users. Another issue I have had with the script is that it plays ahead of the Squeeze by a few seconds, this then cuts off the end of the song sometimes. I really don't care about synching MM with the Squeeze, I really only wanted to use MM to feed playlists to it. So I also changed the following line in the scipt from
SendCommandParam "playlist play", song
to
SendCommandParam "playlist add", song

You have to manually start the Squeeze playing, but for me this is no bother as they are in different rooms anyway. I mute the sound on the PC, go to my listening room and press play. This works great for dynamic scripts like the LastFM Dj and others. In my use I see MM as sort of a Playlist server, instead of a controller. Squeeze's are great, but with large collections they can be tedious in selecting songs to play.

Burger Queenie
Posts: 2
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Location: The Netherlands

Re: Slimdevices Squeezebox / Squeezecenter Support (Plugin)

Post by Burger Queenie » Thu Nov 25, 2010 10:37 am

Hi there,

Great script, love it! Is it also possible to send more commands to the SB from MM? I frequently scroll within a song but when I jump from 01:10 to 02:30, SB doesn't jump to that time. The songs are also being cut off for a few seconds, is there a way to fix this?

Guest

Re: Slimdevices Squeezebox / Squeezecenter Support (Plugin)

Post by Guest » Thu Mar 03, 2011 5:23 pm

po4599 wrote: 5. For those that talk about library, it's more than just the filename. It's the 'star ranking', and the 'number of times played', and the playlists, and the streaming media sources. MM is amazingly great at managing this stuff.


For me mobile editing is the main missing thing. At least edit 'genres', 'ratings' and 'playlists' while listening from any Squeezebox device anywhere in the house. Increasing the 'number of times played' would be a plus. See ''Feature request: Edit Genres, Rating of Songs and Save to Playlist' http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=86054

Metazargo
Posts: 41
Joined: Mon Jan 25, 2010 8:24 am

Re: Slimdevices Squeezebox / Squeezecenter Support (Plugin)

Post by Metazargo » Thu Mar 03, 2011 5:25 pm

Guest wrote:For me mobile editing is the main missing thing.
Me is me ;-)
Music Management: Media Monkey 4.0.2.1462
Music Playing: Squeezebox Server (QPKG); Squeezebox Touch, -Radio, -Controller, -Receiver; SoftSqueeze; iPeng on iPhone
Music Store: QNAP TS-259 Pro with Western Digital Caviar Black 2TB WD2001FASS in Raid 1 Ext3

illusion8055
Posts: 4
Joined: Sat Jan 24, 2009 12:29 pm

Re: Slimdevices Squeezebox / Squeezecenter Support (Plugin)

Post by illusion8055 » Fri Mar 11, 2011 1:17 pm

Guys check out the iTunes XML export plugin.

I AM IN LOVE!!

Finally a world where I can blend the nice PC interface of MM, FLAC integration, iPod/iPhone/iPad sync, and SB playback.

To think of the hoops I used to jump through to get everything synced up and working (J River, iTunes Temp mini library folders (for iPhone sync in iTunes), regular manual playlist exports, manual SC rescans)

Thanks you MM and the community!

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