Type is automatically set to Classical in MM4

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komarek
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Re: Type is automatically set to Classical in MM4 [#15333]

Post by komarek » Mon Jun 18, 2018 8:00 am

I just want to remind the developers that there should be a way to completely disable the automatic classification of files into the "classical music" type. I keep my music collection on the hard drive of my main pc in my office. Every time one of my windows computers elsewhere in my house resyncs its music database with my primary server the computer I am working on reclassifies my music -- and that happens pretty frequently now that windows 10 is messing with home network settings. Just today I reclassified over 17,000 music files from "classical music" to "music" type on one of my PCs. This is a trivial annoyance, to be sure (it took maybe three minutes from start to finish), but it could be fixed forever if I were able to remove the "classical" genre from the "classical music" type definition, or disable that "type" altogether.

The additional fields and program mannerisms associated with the "classical music" collection and type are useless to me. They just complicate how I add music to my collection and use the program. They also complicate how I build playlists and sync with my iPod.

I am not a music librarian, radio announcer or archivist. I just want to play my music files without too much mental overhead or fuss.

Thanks for listening.

Best regards,

--pk---

Onweerwolf
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Re: Type is automatically set to Classical in MM4

Post by Onweerwolf » Mon Jun 18, 2018 4:26 pm

Yes please.
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bateye23
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Re: Type is automatically set to Classical in MM4

Post by bateye23 » Thu Jul 19, 2018 2:29 am

Yes that's a good idea, it's annoying to reclassify it again, there's should be a tag or category type in it.

jelinj8

Re: Type is automatically set to Classical in MM4

Post by jelinj8 » Thu Jan 03, 2019 8:22 am

Hello,
the same problem goes with "Audiobooks" - they are all the time registered as "Music" and I have to retag the type every time.
I'd like to differentiate types by location on HDD.
One of important function of different types is how it is synchronized to portable players (e.g. I have an Audiobooks folder on my phone, that is indexed by audiobooks player and Music folder for music, Movies for videos and so on).

Lowlander
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Re: Type is automatically set to Classical in MM4

Post by Lowlander » Fri Jan 11, 2019 1:58 pm

Lowlander (MediaMonkey user since 2003)

Onweerwolf
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Re: Type is automatically set to Classical in MM4

Post by Onweerwolf » Fri Jan 11, 2019 3:58 pm

It's amazing how after all these years the devs still haven't fixed this problem.

Not every file tagged with the term 'classical' in it's genre tag is actual classical music. Moreso, even if they were not everyone wants to use the classical type collection even if they do have files that are actually classical music.

Software thinking and deciding for you = bad software. No excuse.

Developers; you should make this auto-typing optional. I don't care if it's on by default after installation, just make it optional.
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Lowlander
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Re: Type is automatically set to Classical in MM4

Post by Lowlander » Fri Jan 11, 2019 4:19 pm

Like said before it only has minor affects (Properties/MMA sync) which can easily be remedied with changing Type. Collections isn't affected as Music now includes Type Music and Classical Music and Gold users can change the Criteria to anything.

You could even setup an AutoPlaylist with Genre = Neoclassical AND Type = Classical Music to easily identify affected files to easily change Type.

Type is an internal mechanism and doesn't affect the files themselves.


That said, an exact matching makes sense to me: https://www.ventismedia.com/mantis/view.php?id=15333
Lowlander (MediaMonkey user since 2003)

Onweerwolf
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Re: Type is automatically set to Classical in MM4

Post by Onweerwolf » Fri Jan 11, 2019 4:22 pm

Lowlander wrote:
Fri Jan 11, 2019 4:19 pm
Like said before it only has minor affects (Properties/MMA sync) which can easily be remedied with changing Type. Collections isn't affected as Music now includes Type Music and Classical Music and Gold users can change the Criteria to anything.

You could even setup an AutoPlaylist with Genre = Neoclassical AND Type = Classical Music to easily identify affected files to easily change Type.

Type is an internal mechanism and doesn't affect the files themselves.


That said, an exact matching makes sense to me: https://www.ventismedia.com/mantis/view.php?id=15333
All of this is irrelevant.

MM shouldn't auto-change the type if we don't want it to do that. There is currently no way to prevent the software from doing that. The fact that we can undo it is irrelevant because it is not a solution to the problem but rather a patch to fight the symptom.
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Peke
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Re: Type is automatically set to Classical in MM4

Post by Peke » Sun Jan 13, 2019 9:05 pm

Hi,
Just to step in, only difference with Classical Type and regular type is UI and Metadata representation no actual file changes Classical music collectors use different priority tag fields in order to better sort, manage and navigate such tracks.

Type recognition is added added way back based on pools, queries and the requests by hundreds of users, but to satisfy users like you (me also) we left Entire Library tree Node to be easily enabled in Tools -> Options -> Library -> Media tree so do not need to worry about type also we have added Column Type where you can use it to sort tracks so there is no workaround just how user customize and tweak personal experience.

I am fully open to hear what do you actually suggest in order to improve detection for Classical music for collectors?

Please note that MM5 is still open for suggestions and free for all MM 2-4 Gold users till we start MM5 sales, I'll be glad to hear your suggestions.

Otherwise I see https://www.ventismedia.com/mantis/view.php?id=15333 as good point in improving.
Best regards,
Pavle
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Onweerwolf
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Re: Type is automatically set to Classical in MM4

Post by Onweerwolf » Tue Jan 15, 2019 7:26 am

Peke wrote:
Sun Jan 13, 2019 9:05 pm
Hi,
Just to step in, only difference with Classical Type and regular type is UI and Metadata representation no actual file changes Classical music collectors use different priority tag fields in order to better sort, manage and navigate such tracks.
It changes how the database handles those files. Files that are autotagged as being classical do not show up in playlists that have type = music as criteria. It also results in MM ignoring the playback rules for those types that are set for 'Music'.
Type recognition is added added way back based on pools, queries and the requests by hundreds of users, but to satisfy users like you (me also) we left Entire Library tree Node to be easily enabled in Tools -> Options -> Library -> Media tree so do not need to worry about type also we have added Column Type where you can use it to sort tracks so there is no workaround just how user customize and tweak personal experience.
Yes, I can edit things to make them how I want them to be but that's not the point. The point is that MM changes things to how I not want them to be when I add a file and then I have to change them back. That is just pointless. It's not a huge problem, it's just annoying. And it's not how good useful software needs to work imo.

When I hire someone to paint my house and give him two colors of paint he won't just go and paint one wall red and the other blue. He will ask me what I want before he starts and then does what I want. Sure he can just start painting and then when I tell him it's wrong he can paint them again and fix it, but what's the point of that?
I am fully open to hear what do you actually suggest in order to improve detection for Classical music for collectors?
Pretty easy: add an option to ignore autosort to type based on tag value and have all new files added to the library with the same extension default to the same type. So that all mp3's and flacs, etc. default to being Music.

It can be an obscure and hidden option that's off by default and I don't care where it is, I'd even happily edit an .ini file or even run it as a script if it can't be part of the client itself as long as it's a possibility somehow.
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Ludek
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Re: Type is automatically set to Classical in MM4

Post by Ludek » Wed Jan 16, 2019 5:07 am

Hi,
I guess it makes sense to add a general checkbox that would disable the current auto-guessing of file type.

Added as https://www.ventismedia.com/mantis/view ... 333#c52096

Peke
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Re: Type is automatically set to Classical in MM4

Post by Peke » Wed Jan 16, 2019 3:42 pm

Hi,
Glad that we touched this, I wonder would custom types would solve this where you can define how MM would determine each type.

We are trying to make things possible without complicating them further.

Onweerwolf, let us know what you think?
Best regards,
Pavle
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Erwin Hanzl
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Re: Type is automatically set to Classical in MM4

Post by Erwin Hanzl » Wed Feb 27, 2019 5:29 am

Hello Pavle,

https://www.ventismedia.com/mantis/view ... 333#c52096
I changed the rules for the file to be regarded as Classical music when
- Genre includes 'Classical', 'Classical music', 'Avant-Garde', 'Opera', 'Orchestral', 'Baroque', 'Chant', 'Choral', 'Chamber', 'Impressionist', 'Medieval', 'Renaissance'
genre does not include 'neoclassical', 'rock', 'jazz'
Changed in 4.1.24.1883 and merged to 5.0.0.2049
I would like to point out:
Rules that run in the background, especially for newcomers to MM are difficult to see through and lose after unwanted results, the interest in this, but very professional software. For me as a beginner it was a tedious way to see through this architecture.

I think the above automatic rule in this form is a strategic mistake, because now imagine, suddenly disappear from my collection "Music" quite a few titles with the genre "Classical".
And now introduce newcomers to the first scan. Questions - incomprehension - next software provider.
Everyone has their own philosophy

Best regards, Erwin
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MMW 4.1.25.1895 Gold | Design: GLIDED 18px --- View: DETAIL
CustomFieldsTagger 1.0.3.0 | Discogs Tagger 5.7.1 | External Tools 1.4. | FindCurrentPlayingTrack 1.3.2
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Lowlander
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Re: Type is automatically set to Classical in MM4

Post by Lowlander » Wed Feb 27, 2019 10:52 am

That's why Classical Music is now included in the Music Collection by default for new installs.
Lowlander (MediaMonkey user since 2003)

Erwin Hanzl
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Re: Type is automatically set to Classical in MM4

Post by Erwin Hanzl » Wed Feb 27, 2019 11:08 am

Hello Lowlander,

That's a solution I can live with.
Thank you
MMW 4.1.25.1895 Gold | Design: GLIDED 18px --- View: DETAIL
CustomFieldsTagger 1.0.3.0 | Discogs Tagger 5.7.1 | External Tools 1.4. | FindCurrentPlayingTrack 1.3.2
Lyrics and Comment Viewer 2.2.0.0 | Randomise Playlist 1.3. | Shortcut Creator 1.0
MMA 1.3.6.0881 Beta-Tester | Huawei Mate 20 Pro 128GB | Android 9 | USB-Cable-Sync
Win 10 Pro 1903 64-Bit | Defender with real-time protection | 2 x SSD on board

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