GAPLESS! ARRGH :P [#16940]

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Ozzey
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GAPLESS! ARRGH :P [#16940]

Post by Ozzey »

I'm sorry if I'm beating this subject like a dead horse, but it's just not happening.

I have tried forever to get Gapless Playback to work on MM3. Please don't suggest the FAQ fixes, they don't work and it's not true gapless anyway; it cuts off the ends of tracks that need it.

I've been trying like crazy. I installed Winamp today, and was so angry haha. It has gapless playback with my LAME mp3s, natively! However, Winamp's not what I want. There's a better UI in MM, I have better sound in MM, but playback... not so much. If MM is based off of Winamp, why is there no Gapless? It just bugs me to no end. I've invested way too much time to go switching programs.

So my wish is, true gapless playback (with files that support it). If this isn't possible, can someone please, please tell me why it's not possible, instead of sending me on a goose chase? This is the only gripe I have with this program. It's an amazing program, and would be absolutely perfect with Gapless. Thanks for putting up hahaha.
rovingcowboy
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Re: GAPLESS! ARRGH :P

Post by rovingcowboy »

did you try going to the windows media player options and setting the buffers on the directsound output plugin.

then going back to media monkey and to its output plugin for direct sound and setting the options on it. to try and see if the gapless will work with out cutting off the songs.

it seems strange but that is the only buffer for direct sound that you can use to set them. unless winamp has that option also..

but mediamonkey 3 does use some of the files from wmp for playback of wma files maybe the buffers on its plugin will work with out trying winamp?
but update wmp if you have not just to make sure the files it uses are updated.
:)
roving cowboy / keith hall. My skins http://www.mediamonkey.com/forum/viewto ... =9&t=16724 for some help check on Monkey's helpful messages at http://www.mediamonkey.com/forum/viewto ... 4008#44008 MY SYSTEMS.1.Jukebox WinXp pro sp 3 version 3.5 gigabyte mb. 281 GHz amd athlon x2 240 built by me.) 2.WinXP pro sp3, vers 2.5.5 and vers 3.5 backup storage, shuttle 32a mb,734 MHz amd athlon put together by me.) 3.Dell demension, winxp pro sp3, mm3.5 spare jukebox.) 4.WinXp pro sp3, vers 3.5, dad's computer bought from computer store. )5. Samsung Galaxy A51 5G Android ) 6. amd a8-5600 apu 3.60ghz mm version 4 windows 7 pro bought from computer store.
Ozzey
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Re: GAPLESS! ARRGH :P

Post by Ozzey »

No, WMP is updated...

Winamp, man! I don't know... most of my files are all mp3, and a good portion of them are LAME VBR encoded, which means gapless for certain media players. AFAIK, this is Winamp, foobar, XMPlay, (add media program here). I'm just sort of annoyed that there seems to be no real solution for it in MM. I'm not the only one who has had this problem, and I've searched up on it too, but nothing concrete comes up, and I'm left with an amazing program that has a gaping flaw in it. I just want to know if there's anything the developers can do to rectify this. I hope it's not asking too much. And as I said, I have no intention of leaving MM... yet. but if I get more gapless albums, I may have to switch programs, and that would be really crappy :P.
nohitter151
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Re: GAPLESS! ARRGH :P

Post by nohitter151 »

Ozzey wrote:No, WMP is updated...

Winamp, man! I don't know... most of my files are all mp3, and a good portion of them are LAME VBR encoded, which means gapless for certain media players. AFAIK, this is Winamp, foobar, XMPlay, (add media program here). I'm just sort of annoyed that there seems to be no real solution for it in MM. I'm not the only one who has had this problem, and I've searched up on it too, but nothing concrete comes up, and I'm left with an amazing program that has a gaping flaw in it. I just want to know if there's anything the developers can do to rectify this. I hope it's not asking too much. And as I said, I have no intention of leaving MM... yet. but if I get more gapless albums, I may have to switch programs, and that would be really crappy :P.
I don't get it either. I have perfect gapless playback for my albums through MM. What settings/plugins exactly are you using??
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Ozzey
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Re: GAPLESS! ARRGH :P

Post by Ozzey »

I'm using the in_mad v2 plugin and Media Monkey 2's Direct Sound 2.7 plugin. My old computer was capable of doing something close to gapless (although it was cutting the ends of the songs), and that one was from 2003! My new one runs circles around the old one, and it can't even get any sort of gapless right in MM :S
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Re: GAPLESS! ARRGH :P

Post by nohitter151 »

Have you tried the default plugins with MM? I'm using in_wmp3 and out_MMDS.dll with the following settings: Remove silence at beginning/end of track and hardware acceleration enabled. Gapless playback works fine for me.
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Ozzey
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Re: GAPLESS! ARRGH :P

Post by Ozzey »

no cigar man. It cuts off like, half a second of sound that needs to be there to complete the gapless transition. In other words, I'm still struggling lol
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Re: GAPLESS! ARRGH :P

Post by rovingcowboy »

did you try the buffers on the old style direct sound plugin on wmp.

and then use the mm3 direct sound plug in, that on as far as i know is the only one they put crossover .

but what your saying is it sounds like there is either no silent space on the songs or the setting is used to cut it off.
did you trim the silent space off the mp3s ? i know the help is hard in coming on some things like this but it does seem to be only a few with the same trouble you got. if my sign... in the posts was read and every one did the suggestion on that helpful tips page i did, then anyone with the error that has the same equipment and hardware as you might begin to see a pattern to the cause of the error. i really don't know why you and the others get it and me and nohitter151 and others don't get the error. i got 3 computers on xp pro sp3 and use mm3 default no scripts on it and none of the get the error. so i can only guess it has some thing to do with set up of buffers or different hardware like cheap sound card.

maybe someone with the error you got that fixed it will post what they did. but don't you just hate it when there are so few that have the same error you do. ? but it kind of makes you an exclusive club, granted its one i don't want in. :)

don't give up keep trying to fix it and when you do post back and help the others with the error fix theirs.
8)
roving cowboy / keith hall. My skins http://www.mediamonkey.com/forum/viewto ... =9&t=16724 for some help check on Monkey's helpful messages at http://www.mediamonkey.com/forum/viewto ... 4008#44008 MY SYSTEMS.1.Jukebox WinXp pro sp 3 version 3.5 gigabyte mb. 281 GHz amd athlon x2 240 built by me.) 2.WinXP pro sp3, vers 2.5.5 and vers 3.5 backup storage, shuttle 32a mb,734 MHz amd athlon put together by me.) 3.Dell demension, winxp pro sp3, mm3.5 spare jukebox.) 4.WinXp pro sp3, vers 3.5, dad's computer bought from computer store. )5. Samsung Galaxy A51 5G Android ) 6. amd a8-5600 apu 3.60ghz mm version 4 windows 7 pro bought from computer store.
Ozzey
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Re: GAPLESS! ARRGH :P

Post by Ozzey »

well I'll try and explain slightly better...

For songs in an album that have silence, it cuts off about 4 seconds. I know that's an after effect of "remove silence", but I don't want that, so I'm trying to find a different way. But as well, when I play a song that flows into another (no silence), MM cuts off about half a sec, like it's counting it as silence. It's wrong, and slightly annoying.

I have also tried to set the buffers the same way that Winamp has it (2000/500/500) and "remove silence" unchecked. What I end up with is the right gap between the songs, but it cuts off part of the sound, like it cuts off the last half second (maybe even less) of a song, and substitutes it with silence. the right gap is played, except that it's silence, and not what's supposed to be there.

I have an Audigy 2 sound card. And I can't find the DirectSound plugin in wmp either, it's like it's hidden.
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Re: GAPLESS! ARRGH :P

Post by rovingcowboy »

well son of a gun they did seem to remove the direct sound plugin. it was there, its been so long since i set that, i might have set it in wmp 10? :-? sorry about that? try copying the one from winamps folder and placing it in to mediamonkey's folder for plugins then set its buffers and see if that will kick them in to working?

i don't know why you would get your sound cut off unless you trimmed the silent space and also got part of the data in the file. you might have to re do your songs that cut off?
thats all i can figure right now, :(
roving cowboy / keith hall. My skins http://www.mediamonkey.com/forum/viewto ... =9&t=16724 for some help check on Monkey's helpful messages at http://www.mediamonkey.com/forum/viewto ... 4008#44008 MY SYSTEMS.1.Jukebox WinXp pro sp 3 version 3.5 gigabyte mb. 281 GHz amd athlon x2 240 built by me.) 2.WinXP pro sp3, vers 2.5.5 and vers 3.5 backup storage, shuttle 32a mb,734 MHz amd athlon put together by me.) 3.Dell demension, winxp pro sp3, mm3.5 spare jukebox.) 4.WinXp pro sp3, vers 3.5, dad's computer bought from computer store. )5. Samsung Galaxy A51 5G Android ) 6. amd a8-5600 apu 3.60ghz mm version 4 windows 7 pro bought from computer store.
Ozzey
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Re: GAPLESS! ARRGH :P

Post by Ozzey »

Um... that would be every single gapless song I've ever ripped. It works in every other gapless supported program, it's not my rips. I have copied the one from the Winamp, it doesn't show up though. Hmm, I can't believe I'm the only one right now who seems to have this problem hahaha
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Re: GAPLESS! ARRGH :P

Post by Guest »

Not sure if this will be any help, but I do get the gapping problem on my laptop too.
MM's pretty processor intensive when changing from one track to the next, I have a T5550 Duo core on this laptop and like to run it normally in Power Saver mode (don't need all the power, it's quieter....and I'm doing my bit to save the environment n all that :D ) Anyway, I;ve noticed that it's not a smooth transition between songs unless I let the processors use full power. You aren't running in a reduced power state by any chance?
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Re: GAPLESS! ARRGH :P

Post by rovingcowboy »

umm? i never even thought of at power issue? i'm on this desktop and i use full power. im a tim the tool man fan. more power... :lol:
roving cowboy / keith hall. My skins http://www.mediamonkey.com/forum/viewto ... =9&t=16724 for some help check on Monkey's helpful messages at http://www.mediamonkey.com/forum/viewto ... 4008#44008 MY SYSTEMS.1.Jukebox WinXp pro sp 3 version 3.5 gigabyte mb. 281 GHz amd athlon x2 240 built by me.) 2.WinXP pro sp3, vers 2.5.5 and vers 3.5 backup storage, shuttle 32a mb,734 MHz amd athlon put together by me.) 3.Dell demension, winxp pro sp3, mm3.5 spare jukebox.) 4.WinXp pro sp3, vers 3.5, dad's computer bought from computer store. )5. Samsung Galaxy A51 5G Android ) 6. amd a8-5600 apu 3.60ghz mm version 4 windows 7 pro bought from computer store.
Post-log!q

Re: GAPLESS! ARRGH :P

Post by Post-log!q »

Hi!

Just to confirm the problem of gaps in playback with FLAC files which are read successfully in Winamp.
Removing silences (in MM DirectSound config) removes more than the silence.
Changing drivers and buffers capacity did not change anything for me.

Beside that I am new to MediaMonkey. I appreciate its great music management functionalities that will save me a lot of time. However playback (especially gapless, seeking inside track) and equalizer need serious improvements.

My config:
Core 2 Duo 8200, Windows XP Pro SP3, 2 GB RAM
Sound card: E-MU 1616M
Driver: MM DirectSound output 1.00
MediaMonkey Gold v. 3.0.4.1185
Giarc
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Re: GAPLESS! ARRGH :P

Post by Giarc »

Ozzey (or anyone else still having this problem):

Check and see if the equalizer is enabled. You must disable the equalizer in order to have gapless playback. If the equalizer is enabled, it will somehow add a brief gap between tracks. I suspect that's your problem.

With the equalizer disabled, the default combination of in_wmp3.dll and out_MMDS.dll will provide gapless playback. However, to completely remove the gaps, you must check the "Remove silence" option in the output plugin. As a result, some of the silence between tracks on normal studio albums will be removed, so MediaMonkey 3 still does not have a very good gapless solution built in.

I have found that the DirectSound output plugin will often remove 3 or 4 seconds of silence (or near silence) that is supposed to be there on normal albums. Therefore, I personally do not want to use the silence remover option for gapless playback. I suppose that you could enable it whenever you want to listen to a live album and then disable it again when you are done, but that would not be very practical.

I recommend using the updated MAD plugin for MP3 decoding. The latest MAD plugin from the Winamp website has built-in LAME gapless support, so the gaps will be removed by the decoder and you can disable the "Remove silence" option in the output plugin. It sounds like you are already using this plugin. If you have the right plugin, you will see this description in the MM options:

MAD Plug-in 0.15.1 (beta)(with Unicode support)

To install this plugin you can simply copy the files to your MediaMonkey\Plugins folder. You do not need to remove the default in_wmp3.dll file when you do this. MediaMonkey will automatically use the MAD plugin for general MP3 playback, but it will switch to the default plugin if you listen to a ShoutCast radio station.

The input plugin is really the right place to remove the gaps anyway. The only problem with using the updated MAD plugin with MM3 is that the seek bar does not work properly. This problem does not exist in MM2.5. I suspect that is why you are using the older DirectSound plugin from MM2. Replacing out_MMDS.dll with out_ds.dll solves this problem.

So to summarize, the only way I know of to get perfect gapless playback of live albums, plus proper playback of normal studio albums, plus proper functioning of the seek bar, is to use a combination of the updated in_mad.dll with the out_ds.dll file from MM2.5. It sounds like you had this figured out, but you probably just need to turn off the equalizer and the silence remover. It's possible that some DSP plugins could cause problems with gapless playback as well.
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