1256 false information shown for tagless track [#5661]

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chrisjj
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1256 false information shown for tagless track [#5661]

Post by chrisjj » Tue May 19, 2009 6:52 am

1 Drag a tagless file ping-pong.MP3 to the Play button
2 View the track in Now Playing

Expected: no tags
Observed: Title pong, Artist ping, Album Artist ping

This is particularly serious because (EDIT: if '[X] Update tags when editing properties') this false information gets written back the the file tags upon an edit to any other tag e.g. a single click on Rating.

I suggest this be fixed, or a workaround added like that of the corresponding situtation in the Library: '[ ] Infer track properties'

Note: Upon My Computer Track List initial appearence or Refresh, Expected is seen. Then upon e.g. Play of /any/ track on that same list, Observed is seen.
Note: it is unnecessary to play the track - "1 Drag a tagless file ping-pong.MP3 to socked Now Playing" gives the same result
Note: Origianlly reported on 1247

Tracked at http://www.ventismedia.com/mantis/view.php?id=5661 .
Last edited by chrisjj on Tue May 19, 2009 7:14 am, edited 1 time in total.
Chris

chrisjj
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Re: 1247 false information shown for tagless track -------------

Post by chrisjj » Tue May 19, 2009 6:53 am

In http://www.mediamonkey.com/forum/viewto ... 05#p204805 Jiri wrote
> MM always tries to show something about the played track, even when no metadata is available

MM does show something - ping-pong in the filename, accurately - but the information it shows in the Title, Artist, Album Artist fields is incorrect.
Chris

rusty
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Re: 1247 false information shown for tagless track -------------

Post by rusty » Thu May 21, 2009 3:19 pm

The manner in which tracks are inferred will not always be accurate. The question is whether it's better to get it right some of the time or never. I tend towards the former, but would hope that once MM gets fingerprinting, the inferences will become more accurate.

-Rusty

chrisjj
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Re: 1247 false information shown for tagless track -------------

Post by chrisjj » Thu May 21, 2009 3:42 pm

> The manner in which tracks are inferred will not always be accurate.

I have no complaint about the accuracy. I have a complaint about the inference taking place at all - changing my valid tag values to invalid ones. Surely the fact MM has an option to disable this for Add/Rescan confirms how undesirable it is for this effect to be imposed.

While there is no option to disable this, I think it very poor that MM has chosen the less safe action.
Chris

Teknojnky
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Re: 1247 false information shown for tagless track -------------

Post by Teknojnky » Thu May 21, 2009 4:34 pm

I think I agree, if MM plays or scans a track with no metadata and infer tags is disabled, then the only thing that MM should display is the filename.

rusty
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Re: 1247 false information shown for tagless track -------------

Post by rusty » Fri May 22, 2009 10:57 am


chrisjj
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Re: 1247 false information shown for tagless track -------------

Post by chrisjj » Fri May 22, 2009 1:05 pm

That http://www.ventismedia.com/mantis/view.php?id=5661 says:

> MM should apply inference settings from Tools > Options > Library for tracks that aren't in the library.

Notwithstanding:

> We can modify the tooltip to indicate this change in behavior.

... that's I think is a bad idea since it leave the UI seriously misrepping the scope of the effect. Also I suggest that foregoing library inference is a high price to pay for disabling player inference. Does any user object to unconditionally disabling inference in the player?

Also, perhaps before Devs decide, consider if any other When adding files to the Library: effect likewsie act upon Add to Player.
Chris

rusty
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Re: 1247 false information shown for tagless track -------------

Post by rusty » Tue May 26, 2009 10:52 am

I see your point. Any feedback from anyone else?

fyi: we won't be changing this for 3.1.

-Rusty

Teknojnky
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Re: 1247 false information shown for tagless track -------------

Post by Teknojnky » Tue May 26, 2009 11:12 am

I can agree to the point that the player should not really ever infer anything, that should be relegated to library functionality.

But, there are other users that do not utilize the library (primarily use my computer node/player) who may disagree.

In my opinion, the player should simply play and display the file/metadata that it was given. If given no metadata, then it should display the filename only.

The problem I see it is, if a track with no metadata tags but is in the library with metadata, should the player use the data from the library or should it show only the data in the tags.

I would say yes, it should display library data if the track is in the database.

If the track is not in the library, then it should only display data within the tags, or if no tags, then only the filename.

gpzbc
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Re: 1247 false information shown for tagless track -------------

Post by gpzbc » Tue May 26, 2009 11:15 am

Teknojnky wrote:I would say yes, it should display library data if the track is in the database.

If the track is not in the library, then it should only display data within the tags, or if no tags, then only the filename.
I agree
--
The gpzbc

chrisjj
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Re: 1247 false information shown for tagless track -------------

Post by chrisjj » Tue May 26, 2009 12:39 pm

> I can agree to the point that the player should not really ever infer anything, that should be relegated to library functionality.

Agreed.

> But, there are other users that do not utilize the library (primarily use my computer node/player) who may disagree.

I would be surprised if a non-user of the library had any use for player inference, but would be interested to hear otherwise.

> In my opinion, the player should simply play and display the file/metadata that it was given. If given no metadata, then it should display the filename only.

I agree 100%

> The problem I see it is, if a track with no metadata tags but is in the library with metadata,
> should the player use the data from the library or should it show only the data in the tags.
> I would say yes, it should display library data if the track is in the database.

I see no problem there at all - "the player should not really ever infer anything" i.e. I would say no, it should not display different data just because MM has found a (possibly out-of-date) filepath match in the library.

FTOAD, play from file should show what's in the file, play from library should show what's in the library. Cross-over leads only to confusion and error.
Chris

fourteen
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Re: 1247 false information shown for tagless track -------------

Post by fourteen » Tue May 26, 2009 1:44 pm

> I think it would be VERY useful if MediaMonkey gave a visual cue ...
> about where the properties it is displaying are coming from (file or library).

I would rather it not be useful! :)

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