[1460+] MM4 performance with large library sucks

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Re: [13xx] MM4 performance with large library sucks

Postby brandobean » Sun Dec 25, 2011 11:50 pm

I too am seeing performance issues with MM4 compared to 3.x. I have a "sorta-big" library with 31,206 files and had no perf issues at all in 3.x. I tried 4.x in portable mode first and loaded ~1000 tracks into it with no issues so I decided to go for it and migrate my whole database. Whoa... starting tracks now takes 4-7 seconds which is frustrating when trying to audition lots of new songs.

I did the following:
1) Optimized the DB before upgrading 3.x -> 4.x
2) Installed 4.x over 3.x and moved a few panels around back the way I like them (art on the left under the tree, Now Playing over the transport on the bottom)
3) Tried to play songs... am seeing 4-7seconds delay from click to playback start (previously, was instant in 3.x)

Any ideas? This is nearly a dealbreaker for me... I only upgraded for the amazon.com auto-tag fix. 7 seconds from click to play is a regression.
Thanks!
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Re: [13xx] MM4 performance with large library sucks

Postby brandobean » Mon Dec 26, 2011 12:10 am

Sorry didn't quite do due diligence entering all the info (and apparently you can't edit posts?)
BUILD: 4.1462
OS: Windows Vista (I know... I know...)

OTHER NOTES:
* Going from track to track via the PREV, NEXT buttons works quickly (another poster mentioned this too). It's only if I click on another file (even if it WAS the next file) that things get slow.
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Re: [13xx] MM4 performance with large library sucks

Postby nohitter151 » Mon Dec 26, 2011 6:59 pm

brandobean wrote:Sorry didn't quite do due diligence entering all the info (and apparently you can't edit posts?)

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Re: [13xx] MM4 performance with large library sucks

Postby windcrest77 » Mon Dec 26, 2011 7:54 pm

brandobean wrote:I too am seeing performance issues with MM4 compared to 3.x. I have a "sorta-big" library with 31,206 files and had no perf issues at all in 3.x. I tried 4.x in portable mode first and loaded ~1000 tracks into it with no issues so I decided to go for it and migrate my whole database. Whoa... starting tracks now takes 4-7 seconds which is frustrating when trying to audition lots of new songs.

I did the following:
1) Optimized the DB before upgrading 3.x -> 4.x
2) Installed 4.x over 3.x and moved a few panels around back the way I like them (art on the left under the tree, Now Playing over the transport on the bottom)
3) Tried to play songs... am seeing 4-7seconds delay from click to playback start (previously, was instant in 3.x)

Any ideas? This is nearly a dealbreaker for me... I only upgraded for the amazon.com auto-tag fix. 7 seconds from click to play is a regression.
Thanks!


I have 130,000 tracks loaded (all lossless > 600 kbps) I am not seeing any issues, I find MM4 to be the same as MM3, not faster, not broken, just the same. (Vista 64 bit, AMD dual core, 6GB RAM, machine is about 3 years old).

Clicking the Entire Library node takes the grid a full 8 seconds to populate 130,000 rows which is the same as MM3. Doing a library re-scan takes over two days if grid is polulated, takes two hours if grid is empty. Queries, either as auto playlists or collections run in under 2 seconds. Playing FLAC files with no artwork is blazingly fast. Playing FLAC files that have 1 to 3 art images, plays slightly slower but still faster than MM3. Playing FLAC files that have over 20 art images (the whole booklet for example) play excrutiatingly slow, sometimes taking up to 10 seconds to begin playing, this has not changed from MM3. I have not yet tried the art editor or evven deleting images, this was excruciatingly slow in MM3 as well as cumbersome asking me up to 40 times whenever I deleted an image if I want it applied to all the songs on the album or some such nonsense. I hope the art handling is improved but wont know till I need to do something there. I suspect this is still bad because when I right click in the now playing album image area, that context pop up takes about 6 seconds to load as it paints the list of 20 album art names. I think the performance problems of MM extend from two things 1) dependency on a grid that is fully populated for the program logic to work 2) loading art when playing files or doing anything (even the art context menu) that has to do with art.

When I scan my other hard drive I will have the remaining 70,000 tracks added for 200,000, I dont expect things to be much different than now.

MM4 did not get slower, but it did not get any faster either in terms of the library, grid or artwork. BUT MM4 does appear to be faster and more stable in terms of the actual music video playback engine.
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Re: [13xx] MM4 performance with large library sucks

Postby theta_wave » Tue Dec 27, 2011 4:15 am

I found MM4 to be equal to MM3 in terms of speed when querying different nodes, searches, etc. Also, album art caching and display seems to be on the whole better and more consistent than MM3. I have no issue with MM4 in terms of speed with a MM.DB that is approaching 1GB.
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Re: [13xx] MM4 performance with large library sucks

Postby bmilner » Tue Dec 27, 2011 3:26 pm

theta_wave wrote:I found MM4 to be equal to MM3 in terms of speed when querying different nodes, searches, etc. Also, album art caching and display seems to be on the whole better and more consistent than MM3. I have no issue with MM4 in terms of speed with a MM.DB that is approaching 1GB.


That's awesome. It gives me hope! I'm not having issues relating to merely displaying tracks either though. Does anybody have any ideas why I (and a few others on this thread) are seeing specific performance issues around starting playback via clicking on a song? Suggestions?
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Re: [13xx] MM4 performance with large library sucks

Postby windcrest77 » Fri Dec 30, 2011 1:57 pm

bmilner wrote:
theta_wave wrote:I found MM4 to be equal to MM3 in terms of speed when querying different nodes, searches, etc. Also, album art caching and display seems to be on the whole better and more consistent than MM3. I have no issue with MM4 in terms of speed with a MM.DB that is approaching 1GB.


That's awesome. It gives me hope! I'm not having issues relating to merely displaying tracks either though. Does anybody have any ideas why I (and a few others on this thread) are seeing specific performance issues around starting playback via clicking on a song? Suggestions?


I would say the media file has embedded art or has many art files associated with it. This is the main factor I have found that causes a media file to launch into play slowly. Do media files with no art associated with them at all also have a lag when clicking play?
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Re: [13xx] MM4 performance with large library sucks

Postby theta_wave » Sat Jan 07, 2012 12:25 am

I guess I should have amended my answer two posts above by stating that nearly all of my music files (lossy and lossless) have only one album art associated with them that is linked to a jpg in the album directory (99% of the time). As an earlier poster stated, your performance might vary, and indeed be slower, if you have multiple artwork embedded within your music file. I wonder if this issue can be improved for users who have such an arrangement.
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Re: [13xx] MM4 performance with large library sucks

Postby m_bojangles » Mon Jan 09, 2012 3:30 pm

MM4 is basically unusable for me! It's awful. I have two scenarios with two different major issues:
1) 800MB library that is local with all files on a server and referenced with UNC path names: The local machine is a Core i7 monster with 8GB RAM and Win7 Ultimate. Results: One to three songs will play (with very sluggish UI, sometimes taking 2 minutes to respond after starting play) and, at some point, the UI will lock up when a song ends. It will play one more song through and then either just hang completely with no sound or it will hang completely and repeat the last 3 or 4 seconds of the song forever.
EDIT: I should've mentioned that when MM4 hangs, CPU usage goes through the roof and task manager needs to be used to kill it.

2) If I move the same database to the file server, MM4 is now local to the files, but still using UNC paths to reference them. This machine is a 3Ghz dual-core Pentium D (circa 2005) with 2GB RAM and WinXP Pro. When playing songs on this machine, every 5 - 30 seconds, the sound will stutter very, very fast for a few seconds (like a bad remix from the 80s... you know the stutter effect?).

I have lots of FLAC files and part of the reason the library is so large is because of lyrics. I've had this problem on every single build of MM4 since the official release. Scenario 1 is on WLAN with very fast connection (I can stream 1080P Blu-Rays from the same server using VLC). Scenario 2 is not network dependent, but in that case the server is hard-wired.
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Re: [13xx] MM4 performance with large library sucks

Postby Lowlander » Mon Jan 09, 2012 6:13 pm

I don't see this. I have most of my files on a NAS of which many are FLAC, and currently use a local DB (during testing I often used a networked DB not on the NAS though) and files play without issue. I wonder if your NAS has issues, I know mine has. It frequently locks up Windows Explorer when creating a new folder or copying files to it, but playback is unaffected here.
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Re: [13xx] MM4 performance with large library sucks

Postby m_bojangles » Mon Jan 09, 2012 6:31 pm

It's not a NAS, just a straight-up WinXP Pro machine. Nothing gets locked up on it. As soon as I start MM4 on the Core i7 Win7 machine, CPU usage and memory usage steadily climb until it crashes.
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Re: [13xx] MM4 performance with large library sucks

Postby Lowlander » Mon Jan 09, 2012 6:34 pm

If memory usages climbs and crashes you send a debug log (step 4b) to support: viewtopic.php?f=6&t=341
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Re: [13xx] MM4 performance with large library sucks

Postby m_bojangles » Fri Jan 13, 2012 2:47 pm

That's a good tip, felix. I will do that. I think I may have found the problem for me. I am using an ancient add-on script called WebSearch.vbs. I had a bunch of sites in the XML that I never use... and I'm thinking the script was trying to load every web page in the background whenever I started or changed songs. I stripped it down to use just one web site and that seems to have helped a lot! I will look for either getting a new version of the script, editing it myself, or abandoning it in favor of newer plug-ins/scripts that might replace it's functionality. (This is for the lock-up on my local Win 7 machine. I had also described a different problem when running MM4 on a WinXP machine... I will try removing WebSearch.vbs there and will report back later.)
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Re: [1460+] MM4 performance with large library sucks

Postby robojock » Fri Feb 10, 2012 11:28 pm

Are the devs gonna do something about the performance regressions introduced from 1460 or not? We are at build 1472 which they are planning to release soon and there seems to be no improvements on performance.
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Re: [1460+] MM4 performance with large library sucks

Postby Lowlander » Sat Feb 11, 2012 12:51 am

Did you send in debug logs that show the performance issues as this hasn't been reproduced?
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